someone said

Crane · **Joined:** Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:44 am **Posts:** 350

Ghost Bazz wrote:

Let’s all agree not to post anything about warm sounding hardware & what constitutes a warm sound for like 3... maybe 4 weeks.

Agreed. Right after this.

I have done my best to stay out of this stupid debate, but right now I'm drunk.

I have always heard of and considered the term of analog warmth to be the distortion and full saturation of the tape, on analog medium you can record into the red which gives you a warm fuzzy and thick sound. Hit 0db on digital and you clip.

Every SP sampler is digital. All digital equipment has that red "overload" light that blinks, some blink right at 0db (clipping) and some could blink at -4,-6,-8 whatever the manufacturer decides to allow for additional headroom.

Every SP sampler has a bit rate, as this argument is about the "perceived warmth" of the 303 and 404. The 303 is 16 bit, the 404 is 24 bit. So yes you are going to get a brighter sound with the 404 as it will be less colored and more accurate than the 303. The 303 or any 12, 16 bit sampler is also going to have a factory sound to accommodate for any frequencies that sound "steppy".

But to say one digital unit is "warmer" than another is only what is "perceived" by the listener/user and can more than likely alter the sound to be "warmer".

All of our music is sound, sound measured by decibels, decibels being a tenth of a bel, a bel being "a unit used in the comparison of power levels in electrical communication or of intensities of sound, corresponding to an intensity ratio of 10 to 1". In other words perceived loudness.

And chroma caps fucking kick ass (not the stupid colors, fit and feel) and fit perfect on the 202, 404 and 606 (not the 303).

I would also like to propose a poll for a "battle thread jack" between Andy and Hungryman. Both came strong. Hungrymans GIFS just left me wondering what the skeleton would do next, but Andy's beat tutorial really made me want to go make some beats.

I'm going to go make some fucking beats and continue to ignore these stupid ass threads.

Sweat One · **Posted:** Fri Apr 06, 2018 4:20 am

thesisdrs · **Joined:** Sat Nov 25, 2017 9:15 am **Posts:** 265

HUNGRYMAN wrote:

thesisdrs · **Joined:** Sat Nov 25, 2017 9:15 am **Posts:** 265

Crane wrote:

Ghost Bazz wrote:

Let’s all agree not to post anything about warm sounding hardware & what constitutes a warm sound for like 3... maybe 4 weeks.

Agreed. Right after this.

I have done my best to stay out of this stupid debate, but right now I'm drunk.

I have always heard of and considered the term of analog warmth to be the distortion and full saturation of the tape, on analog medium you can record into the red which gives you a warm fuzzy and thick sound. Hit 0db on digital and you clip.

Every SP sampler is digital. All digital equipment has that red "overload" light that blinks, some blink right at 0db (clipping) and some could blink at -4,-6,-8 whatever the manufacturer decides to allow for additional headroom.

Every SP sampler has a bit rate, as this argument is about the "perceived warmth" of the 303 and 404. The 303 is 16 bit, the 404 is 24 bit. So yes you are going to get a brighter sound with the 404 as it will be less colored and more accurate than the 303. The 303 or any 12, 16 bit sampler is also going to have a factory sound to accommodate for any frequencies that sound "steppy".

But to say one digital unit is "warmer" than another is only what is "perceived" by the listener/user and can more than likely alter the sound to be "warmer".

All of our music is sound, sound measured by decibels, decibels being a tenth of a bel, a bel being "a unit used in the comparison of power levels in electrical communication or of intensities of sound, corresponding to an intensity ratio of 10 to 1". In other words perceived loudness.

And chroma caps fucking kick ass (not the stupid colors, fit and feel) and fit perfect on the 202, 404 and 606 (not the 303).

I would also like to propose a poll for a "battle thread jack" between Andy and Hungryman. Both came strong. Hungrymans GIFS just left me wondering what the skeleton would do next, but Andy's beat tutorial really made me want to go make some beats.

I'm going to go make some fucking beats and continue to ignore these stupid ass threads.

Good read.

zendanisdead · **Joined:** Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:20 pm **Posts:** 388

thesisdrs wrote:

Based on looking online, the consensus is that warmth has to do with harmonic distortion. Bass bumps, at times, come with the territory when adding warmth (reel to reel) but low frequency bumps do not necessarily equate to warmth.

Which this in mind in regards to the SP, the vinyl sim is an effect one can use to achieve some sort of "warmth"

I also noticed that the phrase is not quite defined properly amongst musicians.

"Warm

Warm sound has a tilt towards the bass frequencies. The bass and vocals are more prominent, and the higher sounds, though present, are quieter and subdued."

zendanisdead · **Joined:** Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:20 pm **Posts:** 388

anyone who denies that warm refers to heavy low frequency sound is an idiot.
it has nothing to do with harmonic distortion or tape saturation, those are completely different things.

the term actually comes from the fact that:

red is a warm color right?

red has the longest wavelength on the visible light spectrum

low, bass sounds have the longest wavelength on the audible sound spectrum

therefore, warm sound is heavy on the low frequencies.

it's an analogy.

:idea:

444 · **Joined:** Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am **Posts:** 444

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/analogue-warmth

444 · **Joined:** Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am **Posts:** 444

zendanisdead · **Joined:** Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:20 pm **Posts:** 388

andy wrote:

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/analogue-warmth

they're misdefining warmth. yes, analog recording mediums have all the qualities they're discussing and those qualities sound cool, but it's not warmth.

they're making the shit up, it's not facts. but yeah if you want to make up the definition for "analog warmth" as all of those things then sure cool go for it.

and besides, the issue was whether the sp404 sounds warm or not. the sp404 is obviously not analog so it cannot have "analog warmth."

444 · **Joined:** Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am **Posts:** 444

zendanisdead wrote:

andy wrote:

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/analogue-warmth

they're misdefining warmth. yes, analog recording mediums have all the qualities they're discussing and those qualities sound cool, but it's not warmth.

You're absolutely right. I prefer to call it lukewarmth.

zendanisdead · **Joined:** Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:20 pm **Posts:** 388

andy wrote:

Are we talking about warm...

Tones?
Chords?
Scales?
Harmonics?
Sounds?
Frequencies?
Visuals?
Beets?
Toes?

But for real... does the sp404 sound brighter or darker than the 404sx?

404sx supposedly has a COMPLETELY transparent sound. it records in "lossless 16bit wav" so it's supposed to be an EXACT copy of whatever is recorded into it!!!

i have on and tbh.... i can barely tell if even tell the difference between my phono being played live and the recording on my 404sx. it's fucking mindblowing.

this makes it extremely useful as a recording interface to get sounds onto your computer, considering the sd cards.

only thing is, the og 404 has vinyl sim and that shit's fucking dummy fire. SX doesn't have that. also 404 doesn't record in lossless, it compresses the sound (even if it's not by much) so it sounds more dirty and old school.

but to answer your question, neither.

although, if you want a dirtier sound and the sick ass vinyl sim, go for the 404 og

if you want a more transparent sound and a useful interface, go for the SX

444 · **Joined:** Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am **Posts:** 444

zendanisdead · **Joined:** Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:20 pm **Posts:** 388

andy wrote:

Yes, I know man... my point is that the debate of what is warm is mostly subjective.

Yes you have the literal description of warmth in temperature and can even extend to frequencies and visual hues. But in terms of what we are describing "warmth" its more than the literal description. There are other added factors that people interpret differently.

Yes I agree, the current samplers of this decade and prob last decade do not really color the sound. But it's a moot point to debate cause in the and that shit doesn't really matter. All that matters is so and so loves to use it and they love the sounds they are able to produce from that machine.

i mean shit dude yeah that's fine, but i was just trying to explain the sp404 doesn't have warm sound itself. i don't care what anyone does with their sp. that's up to them and cool with me. :wink:

444 · **Joined:** Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am **Posts:** 444

Sweat One · **Posted:** Fri Apr 06, 2018 4:28 pm

Google told me the answer so it must be true.

How do you measure the warmth of sound when sound has no temperature?

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