NEW Roland SP-404A

[THEGREAT]

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lol .

[Alnitak_Kid]

add 4 more pads to that 101XS and i'm SOLD!!

That's called 'MPC Live'

ah.. touche. but then i'd have to join the akai forum :p

[rageone]

haha don`t worry, the ppl there are pretty friendly... and there`s other *ish* you can talk about the new mpc`s because they HAVE been updated, not only "oh, it looks like the old one", "oh, it feels like the old one", "oh, it`s the old one actually but it`s black and green now" and "it`s too pricy"

now, ontopic, is there literally no change but the faceplate? they could at least use green lights for the display instead of the shitty blue that does not match the new aira look

[alecsdelarge]

now, ontopic, is there literally no change but the faceplate? they could at least use green lights for the display instead of the shitty blue that does not match the new aira look

You get a loopmasters logo, surely that's worth the upgrade?

[rageone]

i`m pretty sure that`s just a sticker so it`s not even that

[PHeMoX]

haha don`t worry, the ppl there are pretty friendly... and there`s other *ish* you can talk about the new mpc`s because they HAVE been updated, not only "oh, it looks like the old one", "oh, it feels like the old one", "oh, it`s the old one actually but it`s black and green now" and "it`s too pricy"

now, ontopic, is there literally no change but the faceplate? they could at least use green lights for the display instead of the shitty blue that does not match the new aira look

Yeah man, I don't really get Roland anymore. They had a somewhat good MC-808 and better but older MC-909 and simply let those die a silent death. Same goes for the MV-8000 and MV-8800 which still are amazing samplers in their own right, but have simply gotten too slow for today's music production. One of the few samplers Roland still seemingly cared about has gotten nothing but a face lift twice now. It's quite pathetic really.

I want a modernised (stand-alone) SP-606 that compete with the Maschine MK2/MK3s and a new Roland MV that competes with the MPC X / MPC Live. The SP-404 can still be the great FX box / portable sampler it always was, but it definitely needs more of an update than just the faceplate colour or a new sound library. Speaking of which, these Loopmasters people have managed to get their packs onto basically all brands of devices, so chances are I already got most of their stuff.

/end of rant lol

[Teddyp]

I just got an sp in January and am new to music production... but yea this is some bs... I wonder how many they will really sell?

[thesisdrs]

I tried the new line of MPC's... i hate the way the pads feel. I'm not the biggest fan of their workflow either.

[djazid]

haha don`t worry, the ppl there are pretty friendly... and there`s other *ish* you can talk about the new mpc`s because they HAVE been updated, not only "oh, it looks like the old one", "oh, it feels like the old one", "oh, it`s the old one actually but it`s black and green now" and "it`s too pricy"

now, ontopic, is there literally no change but the faceplate? they could at least use green lights for the display instead of the shitty blue that does not match the new aira look

Yeah man, I don't really get Roland anymore. They had a somewhat good MC-808 and better but older MC-909 and simply let those die a silent death. Same goes for the MV-8000 and MV-8800 which still are amazing samplers in their own right, but have simply gotten too slow for today's music production. One of the few samplers Roland still seemingly cared about has gotten nothing but a face lift twice now. It's quite pathetic really.

I want a modernised (stand-alone) SP-606 that compete with the Maschine MK2/MK3s and a new Roland MV that competes with the MPC X / MPC Live. The SP-404 can still be the great FX box / portable sampler it always was, but it definitely needs more of an update than just the faceplate colour or a new sound library. Speaking of which, these Loopmasters people have managed to get their packs onto basically all brands of devices, so chances are I already got most of their stuff.

/end of rant lol

What you want (and everyone else ?) is a smaller version of the Yamaha RS7000 (by Roland).....

[SP-USER]

I'm new here and while some might say I have no right to rant, I'm gonna counter that thought with tough, I'm gonna rant anyway ...

My opinion at this present moment in time is that Roland are pretty much taking the piss, milking every little they can out of the design of the 404. I reckon "404 Day" is just a part of the drive to sell this relic in a modern world.

I use the term "relic" because a design that has now seen three iterations still:

1 - Cannot load samples into specific pads despite having a card slot despite having the ability to load samples from the card, and a display that can handle sample numbers from 000 to 999. The fact you cannot dial-in a specific sample number from 000 to 120 and just load it in then, must either be a piss take or just plain fucking arrogance on the part of the designers.

2 - Cannot control the Pan position of a sample despite being a stereo device. To release a stereo music making ANYTHING without some sort of Pan or Balance control, again, is plain fucking arrogance.

3 - Cannot perform the single most important task when working with samples, that being to change the pitch up and down by speeding it up and slowing it down. Again, it's plain fucking arrogance since even the cheaper model can do this.

4 - Cannot resample a playing pattern despite having resample capability. I have just realised from other posts on here and elsewhere that this pig of a device cannot even resample it's own fucking patterns. This is despite that it is perfectly capable of resampling pads that are playing, otherwise you would not be able to resample your live finger drumming.

In a nutshell, the 404 is an overpriced piece of kit that has gained a following for two reasons only. The first being its built in effects, the second being its hands-on approach to resampling.

Ultimately, the work being produced with it is what counts, and if you're a sucker for punishment as 404 users obviously are, then more power to you. Personally, I think it's a piss take, and if the "SX" that is displayed on my "A" model is perfectly normal, then all I can say is development of this thing is so lame they cannot even be arsed to update the power-on sequence display to reflect the "New" model on my "A".

Then there's the unreliability of it. Haven't messed around with it that much since receiving it the other day, but already I have noticed it often failing to switch effects on/off when pressing the effect buttons sometimes.

Finally, the pads are absolute garbage and not even fit for purpose IMHO. The whole point of a pad-based system is to give a comfortable experience when hitting pads. The 404 pads though, are those stupid clicky types that have physical movement beneath them. Fucking retarded choice that was for a pad sampler!

I'd be lying if I said I hated the thing, because truth is, despite all of this, I do still like it and have even more respect than I had before for those who use it, but man, what an overpriced piss-take when you consider that Roland's own MC-101 completely slaughters this thing. The 101 cannot sample, but it CAN resample standalone and even have samples imported. And since you cannot select specific samples on the 404 anyway, it's pretty much irrelevant.

I was planning to buy the new AKAI MPC ONE when I got sidetracked by the 404, and the only reason the 404 won in the end was that it can be battery powered and the MPC ONE cannot. The MPC ONE is a fully-loaded music production studio in a box and totally slaughters the 404. If I could power the MPC ONE by battery I would return the 404 in a heartbeat, regardless of the 'tough love' effection I have for it!

The 404 can be likened to an incredibly attractive woman who keeps teasing you, then slaps your fucking face whenever you want to go further - bitch!

[Crane]

Sorry, I know this is the sp forums, but even from your original post, why did you buy a 404?
the mpc500 is battery powered, does everything you were questioning about and runs circles around a 404 and cost less.

[SP-USER]

Sucker for punishment I guess, just like every 404 owner out there must be. I knew of some of the limitations but had convinced myself there must have been workarounds for most if not all of them. The limitations were so incredibly outrageous that I thought, nah, there must be a workaround, Roland can't possibly expect people to accept such ridiculous limitations in such a sampling device, so there MUST be workarounds for them.

Unfortunately that was not the case, turns out the 404 has to be the most unacceptably limited device I have ever come across, especially considering its intended use. To suffer just one of the four limitations I listed in my previous post would be pretty damn outrageous, so the the fact it suffers all four of them ...

Also, when I bought it, I hadn't realised that you cannot resample from a pattern. I watched so many videos on the 404 before I bought it I've lost count. And not once when they were resampling in those videos, had I noticed they had never actually resampled from a pattern

Never even looked into the MPC500. I wanted something I could stick to and master, something I would NEVER sell, so I wanted to buy from new. That's why I looked at the MPC ONE, it's a totally killer piece of kit but sadly no battery power.

Ah well, still not sure whether to keep the 404 or not. I want to and don't want to at the same time. On the one hand I feel like ramming it up Roland's corporate arse for the unacceptable limitations they have continued to leave 404 users grinding-away under. On the other, I still like the form factor and I do understand why people enthuse about it so much.

I'll just leave it another week or so, see if someone with an "A" model can be bothered to switch it on and tell me if it displays "A" or "SX" when it boots up. I have no other choice than to return it otherwise since it might cause problems if I ever need to flash it. I paid new for it and don't see why I should risk bricking it by flashing 'A' firmware into something that might be expecting 'SX' firmware.

[SP-USER]

I've decided to return mine. I just spent a good three hours with it and during that time it has failed to enable/disable effects numerous times. I have to keep changing modes and back again to make it work as it should.

I won't be requesting a replacement, I don't see any point. Not sure what route I will take now, but I think if I were Roland, I would think about giving my customers some severely needed Novation-Style love. Bass Station II users got a heck of an upgrade recently on a synth that Novation released years ago. It was a completely free, quality upgrade, not a paint-job effort used to resell the same old thing over and over.

Such a shame Novation don't have a sampling and resampling Groovebox type of thing, but who knows what the future holds. It's even more of a shame that Novation are not the makers of the 404, because if they were, you can bet that Novation would be putting out an update video on YouTube, letting their customers know they just fixed the shortcomings.

Then again, I doubt that Novation would be so careless to release something so obviously incomplete as the 404 is in the first place, and that's how I see the 404, it is incomplete and has been since the OG, right through the SX, and still remains a lemming in all the wrong places with the A.

Not hating on anything here homies, just being brutally honest.

[l i f]

Ranting aside, I feel you man. SX or A by itself, fukin headache.
My solution has been to chain up multiple sp's. Gets around all issues except portability.

Seriously, good on you for returning it.
You have now guaranteed you will never catch yourself jerking off the DJFX looper!
Praise be!!!

[Danswift]

"SP-USER" wrote
Sucker for punishment I guess, just like every 404 owner out there must be.

I doubt that Novation would be so careless to release something so obviously incomplete as the 404 is in the first place, and that's how I see the 404, it is incomplete and has been since the OG, right through the SX.



You presume wrongly, i own the SP-404 OG and love the sampler and accept it for what it is.
I understand I'm probably in the minority here but also actually like the fact that it has certain limitations and don't feel particularly constrained by them...it definitely hasn't prevented plenty of folks getting creative with producing dope music on an O. G or a S.X. just as it didn't users of the MPC 60, Emu SP-1200 etcetera back in the day as countless classic Hip Hop and Dance tracks were made using those machines, which let's face it,are almost prehistoric tech wise in comparison to equipment that's manufactured now.

A recreation/clone (call it what you will) of the SP-1200 is in development right now and there's a pretty good reason why there's so much interest in a sampler originally released in 1987.

One word...Sonics.

The E-mu sounds the way that it does not just because of the bit- and sample rate, but the filters and signal path,and yeah, it has some major limitations but it's also part of what makes that sampler so unique and desirable and why so many people would absolutely love to own one.

Slightly off topic seeing as this is the bitching about the SP-404A thread (yes, the samplers 'upgrade' was a major disappointment I agree) but Ive also stated countless times that you can own the best or most technical pieces of gear in the world but you're only ever as good as the actual samples and sounds you utilise.. If you're inputting something whack into your music it'll ultimately end up sounding that way irrespective of what equipment it's being created on.