Sp-808 transformed into Edirol A6

[55cancri]

Mainly You lose the sequencing(recording pad presses instead of recording audio only),and bpm/midi style timing(instead You use time code,i.e. hours/minutes/seconds/frames,as opposed to measures/beats/ticks),and the a6 is a bit sloppier with pad timing,i.e. trigger the pads with say a drum machine,and the timing isnt perfectly consistent.So in a nutshell it becomes like the VS recorders,more than a groove sampler.

yes and its precisaly what it makes me afraid ;;;

but for précisions due to my poor english

did you say that in sp A6 mode , you couldn't record the pad ?!
and they are less reactive ? is that right ?

So If I want
to set it as slave and control the sp with my mac by the logic pro or ableton sequencer ? with the External Timecode Sync I presume, but how about time precision? in live situation could it make it

and the handling of the effects in live sittuation

and
no more synthetiser
a few less effects

woa its not few things finaly

[fninja]

Yeah,the sp has the audio rec and pad rec,whereas the a6 only has audio rec(still record the sound from the pads obviously but not as individual events).And yes the pad playback is not very timing-accurate(random delay from press to playback,no more than 1/2 second or so).Like I said it pretty much turns it into a hard disk recorder.I only use the samples for working ideas,as i can store a bunch without recording to the main tracks.Also has the v-tracks of the vs recorders(8 virtual tracks per each of the 4 main tracks),which makes bouncing easy.If You really want it to be a sampler,I would stick it out with the zips.Another good alternative sampler is the yamaha su700,not quite the same,but after I picked up the sp(and turned it into a recorder lol)I decided on that one to replace it as a sampler.

[55cancri]

what a dilemma ,<!

shit I have still only the 100 zip driver and 24 min to rec in stereo that are not enough for a fucking live set

what about your syquest ez135 drive ??


anyway a 250 could fits me well, where can I find it today ??

thks

[fninja]

You can find a zip 250 drive on ebay or here- http://scsiforsamplers.com/zip-int.asp
The ez135 drive wouldnt work.I ended up sticking with a6 and hard drive.Although 250 zip is supposed to be more reliable than 100 zip,and faster.

[55cancri]

damm very bad for the ez135
ahhg the A6 loose so many things for me

thks for the link, better for me to find i in europe or france

do u think it fits "IN" the sp (first model) ???

woa the zips are so expenssive no !
http://www.amazon.com/Iomega-8PK-250MB- ... =1-2-fkmr0

I have a lot of 100 mb (funy and not very usefull)


(( shure I'll have to upgrade in ex version for 250mb
Concerning that point I had problems I didn't succeed with a pc and midi wire...
didnt anderstand why !!
It gave me a message to wait and nothing realy appends at last ))

anyway only for the effects of this machine, It's really worth to keep

How long we could keep it living ...

[fninja]

the 250 will physically fit in the 808(thats what i have-upgraded to ex,then a6),but I beleive it needs to be updated to ex.If You had problems sending it,can you use the pc midi cable for normal midi(music)?Maybe the file(s) You used arent correct.I can send You the one I used.You can order from the site I posted,You just have to email them about shipping(although obviously if the shipping is too much its not a better idea),or try ebay(make sure to get new disks,not used).In ex mode you can use the fx without a disk,so that could be helpful.

[55cancri]

If You had problems sending it,can you use the pc midi cable for normal midi(music)?Maybe the file(s) You used arent correct.I can send You the one I used.

yes it was a basik midi cable ! but I think maybe the midi device ( mt4) did not match. But there is no other way with the first sp model no?

I took the files from the dead 808 nation site. but yes if this is not a problem for you, ok its nice

I open a new topic for that
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=9351

[putte]

First of all i want to say hello as a new user of this board and at the same time i´d like to thank you all for the infos in this great thread.
I´m a user of the SP-808´s since 1999 now and am still using them for my live-appearances in combination with a drummer. As i shoot my homegrown samples live i of course can´t accept any latency, so:

"... the a6 is a bit sloppier with pad timing,i.e. trigger the pads with say a drum machine,and the timing isnt perfectly consistent.So in a nutshell it becomes like the VS recorders,more than a groove sampler."

Would that be my ultimate showstopper then if i´d go for an A6?

Cheers and thanks in advance,
putte

[fninja]

First of all i want to say hello as a new user of this board and at the same time i´d like to thank you all for the infos in this great thread.
I´m a user of the SP-808´s since 1999 now and am still using them for my live-appearances in combination with a drummer. As i shoot my homegrown samples live i of course can´t accept any latency, so:

"... the a6 is a bit sloppier with pad timing,i.e. trigger the pads with say a drum machine,and the timing isnt perfectly consistent.So in a nutshell it becomes like the VS recorders,more than a groove sampler."

Would that be my ultimate showstopper then if i´d go for an A6?

Cheers and thanks in advance,
putte

Yeah pretty much.Like I said turns into mostly a VS recorder,and the sample section is really only useful for scratch pad ideas,etc.

[putte]

Cheers, fninja.
So i might look for some 750-MB Zip-drives instead.

By the way - as much as i love me those 808´s, as much i´m amazed that during all these years NO other machine by Roland, Boss oder anyone else could give my band exactly, what the 808´s do. Strange stuff. We´d be completely open to make the transition to something new, but somehow our usage seems to be quite unique and simple at the same time. It´s that simplicity that makes us stuck being 808-users.

All we need:

- at least 8 banks per Song (16 samples each)
- enough sample-storage
- cut-off and resonance on the master output
- pads that blink and/or glow while being in use

That´s actually it. Easy, isn´t it?
And though, only the SP-808 delievers.

Cheers again,
putte

[fninja]

For those who have converted sp to a6,and have an OP-1 expansion(for the sp),I've found a way to get the optical digital in to work(the out and coax in/out already work).If Youre good with a soldering iron,theres a chip on the op-1 that inputs the digital signals(coax is number 1,optical is 2)- a sanyo LC8905V-.There are two pins next to each other for the inputs,located at pins 1 and 2(printed on the board).You can simply(dont think there should be any problem other than sharing both wont work-i.e. coax and dig at the same time-)solder these two together(be careful not to solder anything else obviously) and You have an optical input.Hope it helps anyone.

[fninja]

Also found a way to reduce the noise floor(most of the noise is generated by the analog to digital converters for the analog inputs).pin 14 on the dacs(ic23 and 24 on sp main board near the line input ports- AK4520),can be disconnected which disconnects the digital signal to the main dsp,eliminating any noise from the associated input(mic/line has considerable noise,even when the pot is all the way off).IC24 is mic/line,IC23 is aux.The only catch is You have to be Very careful You dont break the pin off trying to desolder it,and the trace may not come unsoldered even if the pin comes up off the board(I used a exacto pen knife to carefully pry it while applying heat from iron,again be careful not to break the pin off).If Using the digital in only,both aux and mic/line can be off,but if not and You dont mind using only one input,leave aux connected as its cleaner.Made a big difference for me(no more extra noise on bounces/recording!)Should also work for SP-808/EX.

[Beat bender]

Hi, many time ago I succeeded in my efforts to Update my old and noisy Roland Sp-808 by installing to it an old laptop hard drive and the OS from the Roland A6 VideoCanvas.

I'll try to explain to you how I did this. Many people has mailed me to ask for the instructions needed to do it, so there they are:

I'll try to explain the full process in English, but I'm from Barcelona, Catalonia, not Spain, and I'm not very good at English...

Ask if you don't understand something.


You can use either a 2.5" or a 3.5" IDE hard disk, but I used the 2.5" because it only needs 5 volts instead of the 12 volts that the 3.5" needed. If you have a 3.5" hard disk and you don't want to buy a 2.5" one, you will need to use an external power source. The good thing about the 2.5" disk is that you can connect it to the internal power source dedicated to the zip drive.



If you use a 3.5" drive, you only need to replace the zip drive with the hard drive, and reconnect it. Plug'n'play! But if you use the 2.5" hard drive, you will need a 44 pin to 40 pin IDE adapter because the connection is different, but luckily compatible.



To remove the zip drive you'll have to remove the backplate, remove the zip drive from the slot, and replace it with the laptop hard disk. You will need to build a faceplate, I used an aluminium piece, I cut the piece and bended it, and I used 2 screws to fix it.

I didn't do it, but it could be a good idea to add a cooling fan from a laptop if you live in warm places, because the hard disk could run too hot and it could damage the hard disk or the information it contains.



You will need the Sp-808ex Operating System, the Roland A6 Operating System, and the Roland software for updating it too. You can download all of this in the yahoo sp808 users groups http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/SP-808USERS/files/

I think that you first have to upgrade to Sp-808ex OS, and then you can update to A6 OS. I did this way, but I'm not sure if it is necessary at all, but you can try the 808ex OS and try how you feel with it...

I remember to read that it's necessary to do the 808ex OS upgrade before changing the drive and install the A6 OS, but I've done this way.

Be very careful upgrading the OS, it's a midi process, so it's very slow, you'll have to wait many minutes.


I did the process with a old Pc with Windows XP Pro and I've had no problems.


You also will need a Midi to Usb interface, or an audio interface with midi out, because the update is done with midi

The latest system software of the SP-808EX is stored in the
Standard MIDI File (SMF) format. Use the following procedure
to update the Sp-808 to SP-808EX and then to A6 OS:
Here is the 808ex OS:
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0Cj1TQTRsP ... rSP808.zip
Here's the A6 OS:
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0Cj1TVP-0J ... l9N/a6.exe
1. Connect a MIDI cable between the MIDI OUT connector of a
MIDI Sequencer that can play back SMF data, and the
MIDI IN connector of the SP-808EX. Use this: http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/wBr1TSkmwV ... FPLAYR.zip
2. Power on while holding down STATUS (TRACK SELECT)
and EFFECTS (BAL/EQ/FX) above Fader A. "Waiting MIDI... "
will be displayed.
3. Play back the SMF data in order number 1 to 8. While the
data is being received "Receiving.. (x/8)" will be displayed
and the pad indicator (PAD) blinks. ("x" is the SMF data
number being received.)
4. When all of SMF data is received "Update System? (Y/N)"
will appear in the display. Press ENTER/YES.

NOTE: Never turn the power off while the message
"* KEEP POWER ON *"is being displayed.

5. When "Update Complete" and "You may TURN OFF" appear on
the display, turn the power off and turn it on again.
You have to wait several minutes, never switch off the sp or it will die. Be sure you have no software running during the operation. I think it's better to reboot your computer before doing it to be sure there are no processes running during the updating. Power on the sp to ensure it has boot in 808ex mode, and then power it off. Then, replace the zip drive with the hard disk.Reboot your sp again, it will fail to load the samples in the hard disk but it will load the ex OS. Power it off. Reboot your computer again (for security again), and do the same process with the A6 Os.



When you are done, the sp will boot as a A6, and then when you go to sampling mode, you will be asked to format the drive. Format it, and you're done! I remember the format tool some minutes, please be patient, you will need to format the drive only one time, it is worth the time...


Take a look to the A6 sample pallete file http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0Cj1TQIU3t ... tte_A6.jpg, because there will be some funcions and pads that will work different. But it work a way lot better in my opinion. You can do the inverse updating wenever you want. You can update from A6 to 808Ex without problems, doing the process backwards.And you can update from Sp808ex to Sp808 OS too.

I've exchanged my Sp808 with the hard drive for a Roland Eg-101 Groovekeybard time ago, because I got an Akai MPC1000, and then I have to sold the Eg-101 because it was an horrible change, I miss my Sp808 a lot, it was very fun, but now I'm waiting for a Native Instruments Maschine, and I think that I will not miss the 808 anymore...
Hope this information help. Post if you need more information. Escribidme si quereis la explicación en castellano o català. Soy Rowf the Beat Bender en Hispasonic.

[Elvizz]

Ok, now the braincracking part starts...
I founda way to view the .mid files from the sp-808 + edirol A6 and guess what, they are both for the sp-808! Only thing is that they adapted a few things for the diff functions like d-beam, step-edit and so on...
What i also found is that its written in ANSI. Now i have to find someone wo does ANSI programming to find the lines (about 2500 per midi file lol) that contain the IDE detection. It's only a matter of finding those lines and copy/paste them from the A6 into the sp-808 ex files and replace the ones that are responsible for the zip drive detection and then the SP should be able to use a HD!!! Well, if i dont find someone then ill do a course in ANSI programming myself lol (already downing about 50 books on the matter cause I WILL FIND THOSE LINES, even if it takes a year). Or just to piss these guys from roland off for the discrasefull act to force a stupid zip while it can use a HD...grrrrrrrrrrrrrand i have proven my right by switching the sp into an A6 ha ha....I'll be back.....

I know this is an old post but you insisted find those line Did you find them already?
Did you convert the midi files first to a text readable format? (I did) They are just a bunch of sysex instruction blocks, impossible to decipher and possible 7-bit aligned. If one file only is responsible for the IDE controller it is maybe possible to narrow it down. All instruction blocks contain lines with a recognizable beginning and end tag.
I can try to make different OS but it requires a lot of testing. If someone wants to test on their machine it would be nice. It will be a lot of work cause you constantly need to upload/update your 808. But again only doable if 1 file is responsible for the IDE controller otherwise testing/uploading will grow exponentially.

[elcmusic]

Hi Every one
I know it's be some time since last msg on this forum,
I just got the original A6 OS from Roland US!
Here is the link:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/601 ... update.zip

You can have the SP808EX OS:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/601 ... Xv1001.zip

And the SP808 OS here:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/601 ... 8v1050.zip

Any one can help with the kit (probably mounting barcket) for the A6 HDD ?
Thanks!