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 Post subject: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:06 pm 
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Posts: 3
I tried so many card readers that I lost count.

Anybody tried the DeLock IDE/SATA bridge vice versa? in conjunction with a sata to SD reader?

It looks promising but again not enough information about these chipsets used. Will it support these ATAPI command sets that the SP808 requires. (I assume that is what it requires)

Description
This converter by Delock enables you to convert the interface of your IDE drives into SATA or the interface of SATA drives into IDE 40 pin.

Specification
• Connector:
1 x IDE 40 pin female
1 x SATA 7 pin female (yellow - host)
1 x SATA 7 pin female (black - device)
1 x 4 pin power connector female
• SATA 1.5 Gb/s and Ultra ATA 133 specification
• IDE supports PIO mode and UDMA mode
• IDE settings via switch for Master / Slave / Cable Select mode
• Suitable for hard drives or optical drives
• LED indicator for power and access
• OS independent, no driver installation necessary

System requirements
• A free IDE 40 pin or SATA port

Package content

• Converter IDE > SATA / SATA > IDE
• 7 pin SATA cable
• Power cable
• User manual


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2020 11:30 am 
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Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 7:42 pm
Posts: 3
Ordered this one, copy/paste the specs from the website

SATA Hard Drive To IDE Converter Or IDE Drive To SATA Host Converter. This is a Bi-Direction converter for serial and parallel ATA translation .
It includes the Serial ATA PHY , Link, Transport and Parallel ATA (application layer) controller.
The serial ATA physical , link and transport layers are compliant to serial ATA I/II.
This converter supports a 3GHz Data Rate.
With LED indicated power
Easy installation & no driver needed
Serial ATA 1.0/2.0 Specification Compliant
Automatic Serial ATA 1.5 Gbps Speed Negotiation
ATA /ATAPI PIO mode 0 to 4
ATA / ATAPI Ultra DMA Of Transfer Rate 16.7 , 25, 33, 48, 66, 100, 133 , 150, 300MB/s.
ATA /ATAPI LBA48 addressing node associated with 2-byte sector count
Support Serial ATA Hot-plug
Ultra low power consumption
Work for both AC and DC couple between the transmitter and the receiver
Provide specified OOB signal detection and transmission
Support spread spectrum clocking to reduce EMI
Support Partial / Slumber Power Management
Provide adjustable TX signal amplitude and pre-emphasis level
Slave Support
Support for Windows 98/SE/ME/2000/XP/Vista


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:46 pm 
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Posts: 1
Did that drive work for you?


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 3:58 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 7:42 pm
Posts: 3
Bit late reply. No. did not work at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 4:24 pm 
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Sell the sucker and just get a SP404 mk2. Soo much more polyphony as far as pads to use. The only ace up the SP808’s sleeve is the fx and 4 track recorder.

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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 2:52 am 
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Posts: 12
Headphones wrote:
Sell the sucker and just get a SP404 mk2. Soo much more polyphony as far as pads to use. The only ace up the SP808’s sleeve is the fx and 4 track recorder.

The SP-808 is still a keeper and you lose far more than you think.

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Members of the Family: (1) SP-808 (1) A-6 (3) SP-202 (1) SP-404
Sold: (2) SP-303 (2) SP-202 (1) SP-505


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 7:53 am 
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They may make a great team though. But I’d only consider a SP808 if I had a 404mk2.

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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2021 9:18 am 
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Posts: 573
Location: Out the back.Im digging up the yard and spying on the devil
TurnDaKnob wrote:
The SP-808 is still a keeper and you lose far more than you think.


+1 ..if you know..you know.

Headphones wrote:
Sell the sucker and just get a SP404 mk2. Soo much more polyphony as far as pads to use. The only ace up the SP808’s sleeve is the fx and 4 track recorder.


There's a lot of features on the SP 808 that unless you own one and use it regularly you'd not necessarily know about, these machines have way more capabilities than just the FX and multi track .

The sample editing and chopping is super precise and works incrementally, Resampling is dope AF...it also has Vari Pitch control,built in synths,Mic,Line and Aux inputs, proper Midi ins and outs,digital expansion options with the OP 1 installed..plus the overall sound of the SP 808 also blows the 404 out of the park when it comes down to sonics too,it's a much more powerful sampler so @Turn Da Knob is absolutely correct when they say you'd lose far more than you think .

While we're on the subject of the 808s FX, i'll also tell you about a secret trick I've discovered, @Headphones.. :wink:

There's a couple of algorithms on the 808 that when you combine them you get an amazing Vinyl Sim style FX simulator...it's very ,very cool , I've been tweaking and messing with this for a little while now.. the A/B comparisons between the 808 & 404 O.G. are really interesting, it's actually getting to the point where I think the effect sounds as good if not better than the 404's Vinyl Sim which is really saying something..I showed it to a well known member here on SP Forums who was pretty impressed with it... I'm not gonna say how I acheived it..that's for others to have SP related kinky fun and games working out..:)....but the FX patches are right there on the 808 if you know where..it sounds like pure fucking filth hehe..it was definitely a big eye opener for me personally ,I've owned 3 of these samplers since their original release and thought I knew these things inside out !

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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:56 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:38 pm
Posts: 339
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Really expensive...but since they are so rare, i post it here.
Maybe sb. wants to upgrade his 808.

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/115186786149?ha ... SwRaFh3kGO

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SP-808 x SP-404 x SP-404mk2 x W30
http://www.thegreatnoire.bandcamp.com


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2022 7:08 pm 
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A new yt-video popped up, where the

Addonics ATA Flash & PCMCIA IDE Ultra Digidrive AEIUDMD or AEIUDMD9

is successfully used with the 808. Look here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WO028zV91c

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SP-808 x SP-404 x SP-404mk2 x W30
http://www.thegreatnoire.bandcamp.com


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:22 pm 
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Posts: 1194
I decided to watch some videos on the SP-808, see what all the fuss is about, but got distracted almost immediately by the whole Zip drive replacement thing.

I'm no expert by any means, in fact until a few hours ago I actually thought that Zip was an optical format (sort of like MD are discs protected in a shell). So that'll give you an idea of how much exposure I've had to Zip. To be honest, I like the idea of them better now than I did when I thought they were optical, but that is besides the point of this post.

The point of this post is that I believe you homies are getting screwed if you think you need to be paying out hundreds or even thousands of pounds in order to acquire hard-to-find solid-state replacement drive solutions.

If you can provide me with the info I need, I might be able to help you locate suitable solid-state drives, readily available from many retailers, but in order to work it out I need to know the following information from you:

1 - On the original version of the SP-808 (the dark coloured one), what connection is on the Roland-Supplied Zip drive, and is it IDE or SCSI?

2 - On the Zip drive of the original SP-808, what is the standard printed on the label that's attached (or should be attached) to the drive?

3 - I understand that you are able to flash the original generation with the firmware of the second generation. However, I need to know if it is possible to flash an original generation unit back to the original generation firmware after previously flashing it with second generation firmware.

Looking at some of the conversations and videos surrounding the process of bringing an SP-808 up to date with a solid-state drive, there appears to be a misunderstanding of what's going on. One mistake is to assume that Roland's proprietory way of formatting the drive might have something to do with whether a drive is compatible or not.

I doubt that would be the case. For that to happen, Roland would need to be flashing their own controller ROM for the drive itself. Roland would gain nothing by doing this because the ROM of the drive itself is already optimised by the drive manufacturer to perform the very best it can based upon its mechanical tolerances.

So what I suspect is that Roland chose to go with proprietory formatting of the media in order to optimize the size of data-blocks being spat-out of the SP-808 onto the drive when streaming to it. The big give-away is that you can get "Disk Busy" messages from the SP-808 during routine operations.

If Roland had taken the standard file system and used that instead, the drive would not be able to perform anywhere near as good as they have it performing, and those "Disk Busy" notifications would be a lot more common and take much longer. Standard file systems are not optimised for working with audio, so in other words, I suspect they have chosen to to create their own file-system, one that is optimised for use with the hardware of the SP-808.

Makes sense and I don't blame them.

So what does this mean? Well, what it means is that you have a perfectly normal Zip drive that you are (for some bizarre reason), having trouble replacing with an emulator or solid-state solution. This should not be the case, and the reason it should not be the case is for the reason given above - it's just a perfectly standard Zip drive (at least I suspect so).

If it does differ in any way, it might have upgraded mechanical components for better reliability, but the communication between the SP-808 and the Zip drive I suspect is perfectly standard communication protocol.

Therefore, it should be perfectly easy to replace that Zip drive with CF or even SD. This is why I need to know what is printed on that label. I'll not go into why I need to know about the flashing, but needless to say that the data you give me needs to be from a Zip drive that was factory-fitted by Roland to the original generation model.

To clarify, giving me details from the second generation (or even a first generation unit that has a replacement drive fitted), is not good enough. It absolutely must be from an original drive that was fitted to an original generation unit.


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2022 6:01 pm 
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Location: France-Italy
TGN wrote:
A new yt-video popped up, where the

Addonics ATA Flash & PCMCIA IDE Ultra Digidrive AEIUDMD or AEIUDMD9

is successfully used with the 808. Look here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WO028zV91c

if only this thing could be available for the mc-909...

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Youtube
http://www.myspace.com/illtrovatore


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2022 6:02 pm 
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Posts: 7726
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SP-USER wrote:
I decided to watch some videos on the SP-808, see what all the fuss is about, but got distracted almost immediately by the whole Zip drive replacement thing.

I'm no expert by any means, in fact until a few hours ago I actually thought that Zip was an optical format (sort of like MD are discs protected in a shell). So that'll give you an idea of how much exposure I've had to Zip. To be honest, I like the idea of them better now than I did when I thought they were optical, but that is besides the point of this post.

The point of this post is that I believe you homies are getting screwed if you think you need to be paying out hundreds or even thousands of pounds in order to acquire hard-to-find solid-state replacement drive solutions.

If you can provide me with the info I need, I might be able to help you locate suitable solid-state drives, readily available from many retailers, but in order to work it out I need to know the following information from you:

1 - On the original version of the SP-808 (the dark coloured one), what connection is on the Roland-Supplied Zip drive, and is it IDE or SCSI?

2 - On the Zip drive of the original SP-808, what is the standard printed on the label that's attached (or should be attached) to the drive?

3 - I understand that you are able to flash the original generation with the firmware of the second generation. However, I need to know if it is possible to flash an original generation unit back to the original generation firmware after previously flashing it with second generation firmware.

Looking at some of the conversations and videos surrounding the process of bringing an SP-808 up to date with a solid-state drive, there appears to be a misunderstanding of what's going on. One mistake is to assume that Roland's proprietory way of formatting the drive might have something to do with whether a drive is compatible or not.

I doubt that would be the case. For that to happen, Roland would need to be flashing their own controller ROM for the drive itself. Roland would gain nothing by doing this because the ROM of the drive itself is already optimised by the drive manufacturer to perform the very best it can based upon its mechanical tolerances.

So what I suspect is that Roland chose to go with proprietory formatting of the media in order to optimize the size of data-blocks being spat-out of the SP-808 onto the drive when streaming to it. The big give-away is that you can get "Disk Busy" messages from the SP-808 during routine operations.

If Roland had taken the standard file system and used that instead, the drive would not be able to perform anywhere near as good as they have it performing, and those "Disk Busy" notifications would be a lot more common and take much longer. Standard file systems are not optimised for working with audio, so in other words, I suspect they have chosen to to create their own file-system, one that is optimised for use with the hardware of the SP-808.

Makes sense and I don't blame them.

So what does this mean? Well, what it means is that you have a perfectly normal Zip drive that you are (for some bizarre reason), having trouble replacing with an emulator or solid-state solution. This should not be the case, and the reason it should not be the case is for the reason given above - it's just a perfectly standard Zip drive (at least I suspect so).

If it does differ in any way, it might have upgraded mechanical components for better reliability, but the communication between the SP-808 and the Zip drive I suspect is perfectly standard communication protocol.

Therefore, it should be perfectly easy to replace that Zip drive with CF or even SD. This is why I need to know what is printed on that label. I'll not go into why I need to know about the flashing, but needless to say that the data you give me needs to be from a Zip drive that was factory-fitted by Roland to the original generation model.

To clarify, giving me details from the second generation (or even a first generation unit that has a replacement drive fitted), is not good enough. It absolutely must be from an original drive that was fitted to an original generation unit.

have you watched the 808 series videos by the Midi Maniac?

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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 1:43 pm 
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ellaguru wrote:
SP-USER wrote:
have you watched the 808 series videos by the Midi Maniac?

Only seen three so far, but it was one of his videos that got me distracted by the whole 'CF Card Reader' thing in the first place. I saw another two videos of his just yesterday, about a potential replacement drive, but that the developer wanted to keep it "low profile" and charge an extortionate amount of money per unit, so MIDI Maniac refused to Kickstart it.

I say good for MIDI Maniac, I would not have accepted such a deal either, and I hope he's able to find another way to Kickstart a suitable drive. He seems like a top bloke to me and I appreciate the fact that he's taking the end user into account. I'm exactly like that myself, I hate to see people getting shafted or taken advantage of - makes my fucking blood boil.

What I've gathered from his videos is that the problem is down to the instruction set used, and in order to fix that you would need a manufacturer to the flash onboard ROM of the replacement drive to the same instruction set as used in the AKAI drive.

Personally, I think his only hope is to contact a specialist Chinese/Taiwanese storage device developer (Addonics for example), and ask them what the minimum production run is for one of their CF drives with a custiom ROM flashed onto it. Addonics might turn around and say, sure we can flash our drives with a custom ROM for you, but there's a minimum run of 10,000 units, for example.

He'd have to supply them with the drive containing the ROM he wants to use, and they could clone it no problem if it's out of patent (assuming there even is a patent on it). And while 10,000 units might sound scary, you need to remember that these large Chinese/Taiwanese electronics companies can knock-out a CF drive at a cost of only a couple of dollars a piece (likely even much less than that).

10,000 units at $2 each would mean a cost of just $20,000 to get the drive produced. But you might ask, ah, but how long would it take to sell 10,000 drives?

Who gives a fuck? The point is that because the drive was so cheap to manufacture per unit, all you need to do is price the product based upon the expected uptake. So let's say just 500 people bought the drive in the first year, and that MIDI Maniac charged a very reasonable $50 per drive.

50$ x 500 drives sold already comes to $25,000, which means that selling only 500 of the 10,000 drives would already break even and leave him with $5000 pocket money for his effort. He'd already have broken even by $5000 by selling just 500 drives, which means that for every other of the remaining 9,500 drives he sells, he does so at 100% profit.

It means enough drives to go around for everyone, he gets some much deserved pocket money for his effort, and everyone gets to own the drive for a very reasonable price.

So it's not impossible to sort this out, but in order to do so I personally feel this is the route he would need to take. The costs involved above are not exact of course, but I reckon they're in the right ball-park. If I were a member of YouTube I'd point this guy to my post right here, make sure he reads this post, so hopefully someone will and maybe he'll consider it.

All he needs to do is gauge how many people will buy the drive in the beginning, and factor into it the fact that there will be people in the future who don't yet realise they need the drive, but will have no other option than to purchase it later on anyway, even if not right away.

I'm a perfect example of that. I only started looking into the SP-808 on Saturday, and already I'm after a drive for it before I even set my hands on an SP-808!

Another consideration is this: If Addonics used to already produce a drive that works perfectly with the SP-808, then surely the way to go would be to ask them how many drives they would need to produce in order to give that same drive another production run. This would probably work out even cheaper since it's one of their own drive designs anyway!

Personally, I think that would be a better option than cloning the AKAI drive, and he would need to demand a sample before full production of course, but I reckon that would be the best route, or whichever drive performs best I suppose.


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 Post subject: Re: Would this be a possible card reader alternative?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2022 6:47 am 
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Location: Germany
https://shop.tattiebogle.net/product/pr ... v3Tk2Trxhf

A working solution for 200 bucks. You save on micro-sd card with this ide-simulator. Only limitation: you have to save manually one time (shift+exit) before turning off the sp-808.

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SP-808 x SP-404 x SP-404mk2 x W30
http://www.thegreatnoire.bandcamp.com


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