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 Post subject: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 9:40 am 
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Hello!! I'm so glad to be here, this forum is pure knowledge and I thank you all for that. I've been having a SP-404sx for like 3 months now, and I've been playing around with it and getting familiar with the workflow and everything. Having chosen the resampling method as it feels more dynamic than the pattern sequencer, I've been unable to find out a proper way to mix the beats or have them stems out in a daw to do the mix there. Is there any way of doing this while working with the resampling method?

Thanks for you help,
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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 11:09 pm 
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If you roll with the resample method you are essentially recording 1-track over and over... which means you can't track stuff out. Check the 404 tips and tricks section for a detailed description of tracking beats out from your 404. You need to build your track in pattern mode to have that option though... or be on a 555 where you can build loops without recording what you are monitoring (pretty sure it does that tho my memory is a bit hazy).

Stems are isolated tracks right? So that is what you'll be generating when you track your beat out. Bass stem... drums stem... or however you decide to separate your patterns.

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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 11:43 pm 
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You might already know this & Ghost Bazz might have answered your question, but just in case, if you have a bunch of variations (resampled loops) & just want to string them together in your DAW to build the entire beat in your DAW, put your memory card in your computer & drop the samples in your DAW. Each "resampled loop" is a sample. Whatever pads the resampled loops are on, drop those in your DAW.

Add sx effects to some of the variations/loops, add effects in your DAW, even chop some of it up in your DAW or in the sx for more song sections.

A lot of possibilities :)

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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 12:09 am 
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ugh what's the point of using a daw when you have your sp404sx

what kind of music are you producing, friend?

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 8:31 am 
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if I'm understanding correctly, you're thinking of levels, panning etc?
It's a bit tricky to get it right on the SP, especially with lousy speakers and /or headphones. Volume levels are pretty much hit and miss, unless you know what you're doing or have some basic knowledge of production. Panning is almost impossible, unless you use certain effects, or pre load the stereo sample already panned a bit (as in one channel being louder than the other ofc) or something.
But if you bounce back and forth between SP and DAW you can do pretty much anything you want :) and it's totally ok, speeds up the process, and keeps you in the flow.
Trimming samples and placing them in loops of the exact same size is waaaay faster on DAW. Playing and creating is much better on SP (to me at least). Combine the two, there ain't no law against it :)

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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 9:49 am 
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LoopmantrA wrote:
if I'm understanding correctly, you're thinking of levels, panning etc?
It's a bit tricky to get it right on the SP, especially with lousy speakers and /or headphones. Volume levels are pretty much hit and miss, unless you know what you're doing or have some basic knowledge of production. Panning is almost impossible, unless you use certain effects, or pre load the stereo sample already panned a bit (as in one channel being louder than the other ofc) or something.
But if you bounce back and forth between SP and DAW you can do pretty much anything you want :) and it's totally ok, speeds up the process, and keeps you in the flow.
Trimming samples and placing them in loops of the exact same size is waaaay faster on DAW. Playing and creating is much better on SP (to me at least). Combine the two, there ain't no law against it :)



completely agree with this mans ^^^

still curious about what genre we're going for here though

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:43 pm 
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ghost bazz wrote:
If you roll with the resample method you are essentially recording 1-track over and over... which means you can't track stuff out.


That's my problem. I like the resample method much more over the pattern sequencer but I need to place the elements properly in the mix. Equalize, compress, level and pan them. I know there's an eq and a compressor in the 404, and the compressor is dope but the eq is pretty limited. And apart from that, if I sell a beat and the client wants the individual tracks to mix them properly with the voice I'd like to be able to provide them.

LoopmantrA wrote:
if I'm understanding correctly, you're thinking of levels, panning etc?


That's exactly what I'm talking about.

LoopmantrA wrote:
Panning is almost impossible, unless you use certain effects, or pre load the stereo sample already panned a bit (as in one channel being louder than the other ofc) or something.
But if you bounce back and forth between SP and DAW you can do pretty much anything you want :) and it's totally ok, speeds up the process, and keeps you in the flow.
Trimming samples and placing them in loops of the exact same size is waaaay faster on DAW. Playing and creating is much better on SP (to me at least). Combine the two, there ain't no law against it :)


Thanks so much for you help. I guess I'll pre-mix the samples in the computer and then load them and play with them in the 404.

zendan wrote:
ugh what's the point of using a daw when you have your sp404sx

what kind of music are you producing, friend?


I'd prefer not to use any daw but I wanted everything to sound well balanced. I'm making hip hop beats and I wanted to try producing electronica (like house, psytrance, techno and that kind of stuff). So specially for the techno side of the game I'd like to mix things properly, and my workflow is creating and then mixing but I'll try and reverse the process.

Thanks so much for your replies, love this forum <3


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:49 pm 
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Hiver wrote:

I'd prefer not to use any daw but I wanted everything to sound well balanced. I'm making hip hop beats and I wanted to try producing electronica (like house, psytrance, techno and that kind of stuff). So specially for the techno side of the game I'd like to mix things properly, and my workflow is creating and then mixing but I'll try and reverse the process.

Thanks so much for your replies, love this forum <3


makes sense, i've always hated how you can't pan properly with the SPs i use.
does anyone know of any hardware that is capable of proper panning?
preferably something cheap.... or a more powerful SP

btw, if you're going to be making electronica, you really need to use the pattern sequencer. i mean, you don't have to, but it's the best idea. you want a solid bpm structure. with the resample method, you could fuck up at any time because there's nothing keeping you from switching bpms. i guess, if you made it in the daw you would know for sure it's the right bpm. and, there's not really much reason to master everything in your daw, then put it in your sp and mix it. you already did all the work in your daw, i don't see any advantage in resampling it in the sp vs. just finishing it off in the daw. especially considering the fact that the 404sx samples in lossless 16bit wav. some people buy samplers to make their music sound shittier on purpose, lower bitrate, lower sample rate. the 404sx doesn't color sound at all, theoretically, what goes in should be exactly what comes out.


p.s. i forgot i was thinking about investing in a portastudio, does anyone know how good the panning is on those?

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:07 pm 
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zendan wrote:
does anyone know of any hardware that is capable of proper panning?
preferably something cheap.... or a more powerful SP


I believe mpc's do that.

zendan wrote:
btw, if you're going to be making electronica, you really need to use the pattern sequencer. i mean, you don't have to, but it's the best idea. you want a solid bpm structure. with the resample method, you could fuck up at any time because there's nothing keeping you from switching bpms. i guess, if you made it in the daw you would know for sure it's the right bpm. and, there's not really much reason to master everything in your daw, then put it in your sp and mix it. you already did all the work in your daw, i don't see any advantage in resampling it in the sp vs. just finishing it off in the daw.


Well I wanted to run away from the mouse and the computer, I wanted the creation of music to be more dynamic, fun and real, and it actually is in the sp. I'll give the pattern sequencer a second chance, although you should watch this video in which house is created using the resampling method:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68Ew0dAP4UA


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:16 pm 
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Are we talking soley about the SP404? Because the SP505, SP606 and the SP555 can pan. The 505 is hard panning though, meaning it'll only do 100% left or 100% right when not in center. The 606 and the 555 are DAWish panning style.

I have used the 303 and 606 as DAWs before. Its more manageable with the SP606 for its Sample Edit has level and panning. The limited polyphony of 8 voices were really my 8 tracks because each sample can be an hour long if I wanted, so each pad became a track that I trigger to play after much resampling to create them. Then I'd pull out the mic and sample a couple verses onto a pad or two to lace the beat with. The 303 was a bit tedious due to mark chopping and getting tracks aligned but it did the deed. The panning trick I did was to sample in stereo and pan from a mixer as the SP sampled the material. Takes up two voices but I was able to play mono samples along the stereo and it was like a polyphony of 7.

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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 3:57 am 
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Ill Green wrote:
Are we talking soley about the SP404? Because the SP505, SP606 and the SP555 can pan. The 505 is hard panning though, meaning it'll only do 100% left or 100% right when not in center. The 606 and the 555 are DAWish panning style.

I have used the 303 and 606 as DAWs before. Its more manageable with the SP606 for its Sample Edit has level and panning. The limited polyphony of 8 voices were really my 8 tracks because each sample can be an hour long if I wanted, so each pad became a track that I trigger to play after much resampling to create them. Then I'd pull out the mic and sample a couple verses onto a pad or two to lace the beat with. The 303 was a bit tedious due to mark chopping and getting tracks aligned but it did the deed. The panning trick I did was to sample in stereo and pan from a mixer as the SP sampled the material. Takes up two voices but I was able to play mono samples along the stereo and it was like a polyphony of 7.


damn should i cough up the cash for a 555 or 606, or do you know a good cheaper end mixer i could use for panning? also have you ever used a porta?
i'm pretty happy with my trio (202, 303, 404sx) as i make really simple old school sample based hip hop. so something external, rather than a sampler would probably be best

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:56 am 
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zendan wrote:
do you know a good cheaper end mixer i could use for panning? also have you ever used a porta?
i'm pretty happy with my trio (202, 303, 404sx) as i make really simple old school sample based hip hop. so something external, rather than a sampler would probably be best


I'd recommend 'Edirol m 10 dx' - it's probably around 150$ now, give or take, that is if you can hunt one down in the first place, it's been discontinued for a while now, and not many of the owners (me included :D) wanna sell it.
It's a fully digital 24-bit/96kHz beast, with enormous high end options (like compression, reverbs, spectrum analysis, scene memory, etc) packed into a small chassis, and it fkn works on batteries (though it drains them rather quickly, so I don't use it outside that much).
Now I guess since it's digital you might be against using it. But you ought to try it out man. Been a life saver to me for years.
Compression is pretty decent (even multi band), loads of controls and parameters, reverbs are workable with, not the greatest but still usable - and everything else is top notch imho - for that price it's a steal. You got ten channels (two of them are microphone designated, with individual trim knobs, and high z option) to mix, so you got yourself all of your SPs + vocals covered and then some.
And it's 7 X 10 inches or something like that, and weighs in at one kg.
Fkn steal man, I tell you.

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 Post subject: Re: Exporting stems/trackouts or mixing a song in the SP
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:05 pm 
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LoopmantrA wrote:
zendan wrote:
do you know a good cheaper end mixer i could use for panning? also have you ever used a porta?
i'm pretty happy with my trio (202, 303, 404sx) as i make really simple old school sample based hip hop. so something external, rather than a sampler would probably be best


I'd recommend 'Edirol m 10 dx' - it's probably around 150$ now, give or take, that is if you can hunt one down in the first place, it's been discontinued for a while now, and not many of the owners (me included :D) wanna sell it.
It's a fully digital 24-bit/96kHz beast, with enormous high end options (like compression, reverbs, spectrum analysis, scene memory, etc) packed into a small chassis, and it fkn works on batteries (though it drains them rather quickly, so I don't use it outside that much).
Now I guess since it's digital you might be against using it. But you ought to try it out man. Been a life saver to me for years.
Compression is pretty decent (even multi band), loads of controls and parameters, reverbs are workable with, not the greatest but still usable - and everything else is top notch imho - for that price it's a steal. You got ten channels (two of them are microphone designated, with individual trim knobs, and high z option) to mix, so you got yourself all of your SPs + vocals covered and then some.
And it's 7 X 10 inches or something like that, and weighs in at one kg.
Fkn steal man, I tell you.



thank you so much brother, thing looks amazing.

as soon as i get back on my shit, this will be one of my first investments in music.

p.s. has anyone reading this ever worked with an akai mpc2000xl before?? with multiple outs? i want to know what that is like, tracking different elements to different outs

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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