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 Post subject: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:36 pm
Posts: 11
Hi everyone,
I'm new to this forum but I've lurked here for a long time. Some of the material interests me while other stuff doesn't. Two questions for the board.

I gravitated to this forum because I own a lot of Roland products and wanted to see what kind of stuff to buy next and if people had issues with anything I was considering.
Has this forum pretty much run out of technical tips and tricks for using Roland samplers? There is a lot of tech advice in the backlog but it seems new material in that regard has been reduced to a trickle, so a furthermore is it the general consensus that this forum has shifted to a music promotion site? Which brings me to the second question..

which I ask only to inform my own aesthetic tastes: There seems to be a large volume of music promoted on this forum by different members whose artwork and song titles look based on 60's and 70's kung fu movies. I first remember seeing those types of references in Wu Tang albums. Have they been the big influence with SP users? It seems like those guys would have been using MPCs more than anything. Is it a generational thing and the Wu Tang kung fu thing was picked up by some newer hip hop acts that used SPs and those guys influenced all the people on this forum that promote their own kung fu hip hop themed songs? On the music end, I have no idea if the kung fu styled stuff sounds like Wu Tang clan, because I thought at the time I first heard them that hip hop was going downhill both in rapping and music and just kept listening to the old Bomb Squad and Lench Mob produced stuff. Just my opinion. I can tell you without question that after my college radio gig I got turned off completely by all the socially conscious indie rap that came in each week, and I am not into Mad Lib or the guy that dresses up like Doctor Doom from the FF or anything that sounds like that stuff, so that's the reason for my second question.

If I have tech questions or advice that I don't see already there I will post again. I'm glad this forum exists, but its purpose is a little confusing when compared to Roland Clan Forums, the MV-Nation forum, VS Planet, Korg Forums, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:40 am 
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nice first post
how long did u lurk and on what sections do u follow?
i joined for the battles and tried to answer\ask a questions before.
i havent been on here forever and i lurked for awhile before i joined. so i am not an expert on all things sp forums.

beyond the musical taste part of yr questions i think this forum is dif from others bc it's not run by roland at all?
dont see any official roland reps answering questions anywhere.
there is a ton of knowledge in the tips n tricks \ production technique sections. i assume its all from users experience\errors. some stuff has been answered mutiple times and ways.
i feel like there has been a cap on new tricks and methods. the search bar is your friend in this case. these samplers are old and dont have new updates\add ons like mpc. so dont expect some crazy new trick any day now :mrgreen:
if u lurked awhile and dont like the community much what can u say? there are trends of kung fu beat makers and an og kung fu beat maker that claims to hold the ultimate manual. if u lurked long u know his name
no diss.
alot of knowledge in this forum and yes nowadays more rampant one track self promotion. it may have been dif back in da day? maybe soundcloud did it?

its a diverse group of people on here, new and old users. i think old users dont post as much so it seems out of control lately. and some people dont make hiphop.
u could post more and maybe find some pre-wutang peeps than use SP just like yrself u never know bro :mrgreen:
peace SMUDGE
hit the pads post a beat join a battle
u can do it all here on sp forums


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:03 am 
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i didnt want to edit my first post on here^
i peeped those other forums and they are all independently moderated like sp forums.
i forgot korg had a battle forum

it looks like those forums are more organized and moderated than here.
also those other forums seem to have mostly technical sections. not much more.

mv forums had no beats in the promotion type section?

i never had an mpc but i hear friends complain about mpc forums. it def gets weird on here. there has been an influx of new users from a dif sp group. and ogs been ghosting, using aka's. if u post old school beats on here some people will hear it. and nobody will bash it. i dont know what its like on other forums i need to buy some more equipment beyond cheap SPs :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:32 am 
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Hi YUBA,
Thanks for answering the more important question of the two. I lurked here for several years, I don't know how long. A while. I have a 404 which I bought new and a 555 that I bought used and did quite of bit of research on here about the latter. I doubt the technique knowledge well is dry, though. But as for the SP's application in hip hop, to which this forum is saturated..

I'm not turned off by the type of music people on here seem to be posting alot of because their's is necessarily amateurish or bad, because amateur or pro really it all sounds the same and you're into it or you're not into it. Plus, I look at it like folks are just having fun with their SPs and most likely imitating paid acts who get radio play, more than really contributing and advancing the form. I don't use my SPs in any way similar to the hip hop approach, and I didn't mean to imply that I was looking for tips for late 80's/early 90's hip hop production. I can hear what those guys were doing. I just prefer that era to what gradually creeped into the scene in the mid 90's. When hip hop musicians suddenly had a harder time sampling any old record they wanted and had to make compromises on samples and had play their own keyboards and stuff I think hip hop in general started to stink. It was bound to happen.

And it's not just this forum, because most of the quasi-instructional videos on YouTube I see for SPs (or MPCs) seem to always be hip hop based and honestly there is only so far a person is going to push their equipment in that particular genre before they deviate from the form altogether. I'm not picking on hip hop, because your average EDM instructional/equipment technique video is pretty much stuck in the same rut. Maybe after a while a person just has to quit looking for new info and plow ahead while telling themselves they aren't re-inventing the wheel.

I put off logging in to say anything at all, but I was curious about the origins of the kung fu thing because it's all over this site, and if and how it was supposed to relate to Wu Tang, especially since those guys were probably using MPCs and not SPs, and I was also curious about the general purpose of the forum nowadays - to which you've answered more than adequately.

I'm very grateful for the technique/equipment review posters past and present. This has been a good place for info. I might have some techniques or findings to share, even if they include other equipment. A fast workflow sometimes demands multiple pieces of equipment.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 7:25 am 
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SMUDGE wrote:

I'm not turned off by the type of music people on here seem to be posting alot of because their's is necessarily amateurish or bad, because amateur or pro really it all sounds the same.


You're not looking hard enough.

There's some great music being made by peeps on here..not everyone who uses this site is influenced by the kung fu thing.

And no disrespect to anyone who does that type of shiz..that's fine with me,do what the hell you like.

I personally couldn't give a fuck about the Wu Tang Clan..they fell off years ago, with the only notable exception being Ghost Face Killah.

The main problem with just about all forms of sampled music is that the vast majority of
people who make it are lazy and unimaginative, invariably resorting to the same tired cliches over and over ..be it Hip Hop,Dance, Drum & Bass or whatever.

It doesn't matter what kit you have, SP's, MPC setups etcetera if you don't have the ideas..I know folks with very impressive equipment setups who couldn't write a note to the fucking milkman..You're only as good as the raw source materials you have at your disposal when it comes to sample based production no matter what gear you may own.

Experimentation,when it comes to sampling is the key in my opinion..you need to flip that bastard and you need to flip it hard.

"Sampling is a state of mind" as Garry Cobain from The Future Sound Of London so succinctly put it.

Welcome to the forum btw Smudge,good to have you here dude !

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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:09 am 
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interesting post!

I just re-joined after a long time away, after i sold my sp :(

now i have another one (borrowed from a friend) and naturally ended up back here to see whats going on.

I see the SP-404 has become almost a genre in itself for some hip hop heads, all following a particular type of style. I don't have a problem with that though, it's like a language or dialect to me.

I WOULD like to see what else is possible though, so people experimenting and doing new crazy shit is always welcome to my ears, rather than everyone just emulating each other or endlessly trying to sound the most like madlib etc....

for me the point is.... just like any small scene.... SHOW THE FUCK UP. GET INVLOVED. don't sit around waiting for someone else to tell you what the scene is or should be.

I think the internet lets all these tiny scenes, that would be otherwise left-for-dead, thrive among the people that care about them enough. So if you have some new ideas, some crazy experiments, some old beats that you just need to export somewhere so they dont jsut get forgotten, sticke em up here. who knows what might come of it!


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:52 am 
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symatic wrote:

I WOULD like to see what else is possible though, so people experimenting and doing new crazy shit is always welcome to my ears, rather than everyone just emulating each other or endlessly trying to sound the most like madlib etc....



Word.

I think that the real beauty of the SP-404 actually lies within the limitations of the machine..you have to really push the boundaries of the samplers capabilities,utilizing the resampling and FX functions to the max is absolutely essential for me, personally.

Even better if you have two 404's to play with!...you can get mad creative results with a couple of them,bringing out the best of the machines..a 404 0G and a 404-SX are particularly good when combined together although I do tend to use the 404 O.G. on it's own most of the time tbh.

I've owned nicer samplers than the 404's ..I had the SP-808 & 808-EX but the problems I experienced using those machines was a fucking nightmare with discs crashing or corrupting,losing entire tracks etc..I know some peeps on here use the 808's and are fine with them but I'm more than happy to stick with the 404's for my own productions.

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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:12 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:24 am
Posts: 444
Let's pack it up guys, this forum is pointless and of no technical use.

I might as well go kill myself too, while were at it.

What's the point of life anyways if Google AI is just going to take over and make humans and emotions trivial and irrelevant.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:10 pm 
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it's already watching us...


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:09 pm 
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edit... edit... edit...

(shaking head... )

Cheers dude. Looking forward to your next post.

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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:17 am 
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SMUDGE wrote:
On the music end, I have no idea if the kung fu styled stuff sounds like Wu Tang clan, because I thought at the time I first heard them that hip hop was going downhill both in rapping and music and just kept listening to the old Bomb Squad and Lench Mob produced stuff.... and I am not into Mad Lib or the guy that dresses up like Doctor Doom from the FF or anything that sounds like that stuff


i don't know who bomb squad is, but lench mob is literally the most primitive, basic, no skill style rap/beats in existence. if you prefer that to the intricacy, complexity, and pure ingenuity of otis jackson jr.'s instrumentals, you have horrible horrible taste, and your ears probably don't work. i feel much pity for you and your condition /:

same thing goes for the lyrics.
do you seriously think that this:

"Cause we ain't made a mess yet
Lench Mob produce the best yet
Coming real hard man
Bumping in your car man"

or

"Cause the bang-bang, buck-buck, boom-boom, pow-pow
Used to be a trick [but bitch - how ya like me know]
Cause the Ak-40 dick hold a 50 clip
And I'll shoot till it's empty bitch
That's how you got filthy rich"

holds more value, meaning, or quality than this:

"By candlelight my hand will write these rhymes 'til I'm burnt out
Mostly from experience, shit that I learned about
Topics and views, generally concerned about
With different ways to come up and earn clout.....
The "SUBROC" three-finger ring with the ruby in the "O", ock
Truly the illest dynamic duo on the whole block
I keep a flick of you with the machete sword in your hand
Everything is going according to plan man"

or

"As the dollar continues to lose momentum
He need land from murdered indians that represent 'em
Gold is up, urging all thugs
Trade me y'all chains for cash and splurge it on drugs
A more secure investment
Food and water, a couple of gallons for your cutest daughter"

???

explain to me the validity of your opinion, please....

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


Last edited by zendan on Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:24 am 
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zendan wrote:

i don't know who bomb squad is, /:


The Bomb Squad are Public Enemy's production team, Zen.

Hank Shocklee; Keith Shocklee; Chuck D; Eric "Vietnam" Sadler; & Gary G-Wiz.

And Flava Flav brews up the tea in the teapot in case anyone's wondering...

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Last edited by Danswift on Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:30 am 
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wu tang instrumentals are also beautiful, and the lyrics have depth, have meaning, and tell a story.

"I grew up on the crime side, the New York Times side
Stayin' alive was no jive
Had secondhands, Mom's bounced on old man
So then we moved to Shaolin land
A young youth, yo, rockin' the gold tooth, 'Lo goose
Only way I be gettin' the G off was drug loot"

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:34 am 
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btw, what the fuck do you use your sp for???


99.99% of sp owners use their samplers to produce hip hop beats. that is why this forum is the way it is. i'm sorry if you're too thickheaded to put two and two together and arrive at a simple conclusion.

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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 Post subject: Re: What's the point?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:40 am 
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Danswift wrote:
zendan wrote:

i don't know who bomb squad is, /:


The Bomb Squad are Public Enemy's production team, Zen.

Hank Shocklee; Keith Shocklee; Chuck D; Eric "Vietnam" Sadler; & Gary G-Wiz.

And Flava Flav brews up the tea in the teapot in case anyone's wondering...


public enemy is basic as fuck too

rap was super primitive in the late 80s/early 90s

people didn't really know what they were doing yet, fashion and trends were cheesy, people were superficial and obsessed with image.

ll cool j's most famous song is him running around with huge gold chains, flexing his abs, talking about how great he is

couple exceptions are out there for the wack early 90s hip hop. some people were doing shit right. don't want to name names because i don't want to put OP on to good music he doesn't deserve to hear ahahahaha

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HAWTKARL wrote:
The last thing we need is another utube sampling digital lo-fi anime beat maker.

IIIII wrote:
he can turn water into a beat, and feed a thousand dancehalls with only two drumbreaks

"If you want that '90s sound, record at 12 bit as HOT as you can."


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