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 Post subject: So Unreliable
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 7:48 pm 
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Did I just get a dud or is this machine the most unreliable recording machine ever made? Either the drive is locking up and freezing the machine when I'm sampling, or I'm recording audio directly to disk and the Drive becomes Too Busy and interrupts my recording at some point. I replaced the zip drive with a 250mb brand new one (new old stock), got brand new 250mb disks, etc.. Digital Input 2 is even more unreliable, often locking and unlocking out of the blue, and Digital 1 (coaxial) isn't much better. I'm only trying to record one track at a time without anything even playing on the 808 other than the input. If I try to have a pad or something playing while recording it gets even worse. Really getting frustrated with it. Might just get a cheap 4-track and record to that.

Is the brand new drive faulty, or the disks, etc.? Or is this just how the machine operates. For clarification I'm trying to record live performances, one or two or three minutes sometimes to a single track. But it happens with short sampling too.

- J

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 Post subject: Re: So Unreliable
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 10:59 pm 
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Location: Pacific Northwest
Something is wrong with the chain of information flow... disc... or drive I would guess. I’m not sure if it could possibly b the unit itself, as I don’t think I’ve experienced a faulty unit... not sure what symptoms it would lead to. I’ve got 2 units myself... 1 w a cf card reader and 1 w a 250 mb zip. I’ve had some glitchy stuff happening on the Zip drive unit so I recently replaced the reader, and went to some different zips. It might have just been the zips in the end because the new drive was still problematic w the old discs. I haven’t tested the original drive w new discs to confirm. I think the drive was also going as the ejecting was getting hella weak. That’s probably just a worn out spring but that’s been my gauge for determining the health of a Zip drive.

Loooong story short. W a good zip disc & drive I have had almost the same level of functionality as w the cf card drive... just noisier operation. That is to say, u should b able to program 1-shot drums across 3 tracks w 1 playing 16th note hats without a read error... up to around maybe 80-90 bpm. Beyond that u should b able to avoid the read errors by pitching down.

Maybe u could test w some shorter samples across a couple tracks? My other thought is that the really long stereo tracks might b eating up a lot of memory somehow, although I think the machine uses the entire disc in place of RAM.

When u get the errors, what does the remaining disc space look like? Also, cleaning up the disc frees up a ton of space usually. Doing a quick disc cleaning usually helps significantly w disc errors. I think the memory used by ur last action is tied up in the undo function. Cleaning up the disc purges it, I believe.

Hopefully this is helpful on some level. I feel like I’m rambling on a bit.

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 Post subject: Re: So Unreliable
PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 6:16 am 
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Ghost Bazz wrote:
Something is wrong with the chain of information flow... disc... or drive I would guess. I’m not sure if it could possibly b the unit itself, as I don’t think I’ve experienced a faulty unit... not sure what symptoms it would lead to. I’ve got 2 units myself... 1 w a cf card reader and 1 w a 250 mb zip. I’ve had some glitchy stuff happening on the Zip drive unit so I recently replaced the reader, and went to some different zips. It might have just been the zips in the end because the new drive was still problematic w the old discs. I haven’t tested the original drive w new discs to confirm. I think the drive was also going as the ejecting was getting hella weak. That’s probably just a worn out spring but that’s been my gauge for determining the health of a Zip drive.

Loooong story short. W a good zip disc & drive I have had almost the same level of functionality as w the cf card drive... just noisier operation. That is to say, u should b able to program 1-shot drums across 3 tracks w 1 playing 16th note hats without a read error... up to around maybe 80-90 bpm. Beyond that u should b able to avoid the read errors by pitching down.

Maybe u could test w some shorter samples across a couple tracks? My other thought is that the really long stereo tracks might b eating up a lot of memory somehow, although I think the machine uses the entire disc in place of RAM.

When u get the errors, what does the remaining disc space look like? Also, cleaning up the disc frees up a ton of space usually. Doing a quick disc cleaning usually helps significantly w disc errors. I think the memory used by ur last action is tied up in the undo function. Cleaning up the disc purges it, I believe.

Hopefully this is helpful on some level. I feel like I’m rambling on a bit.


It does help and I appreciate it. Rambling encouraged.

To answer your questions, I'm using a brand new 250mb disk, so the remaining time is over 50 minutes. Will try the disk cleanup trick, the Undo function could be part of it.

Now I'll ramble. Sometimes it doesn't even take long samples. I could start recording a Digital 1 or Digital 2 input sample, and within seconds of starting recording the drive could freeze up and require a restart of the 808. Happened with the old drive (100mb) which is why I replaced it with the brand new 250mb. Same issues. New coax cable, new s/pdif cable, happens with both (although the Digital 2 s/pdif would unlock a lot more. I actually just blew some air in the input itself and that seemed to help a lot.)

The machine is almost unusable now, even with the new drive and disks. Sometime it gets too busy when just a simple drum loop I sampled is playing on the pads. I have a few new disks coming to try them now, because I *did* turn the machine off a few times with a disk in it (it's easy to forget, and apparently this could cause harm to the disks.) So hopefully the new disks work. Guess I might have to buy another new 250mb or something to test that. How hard is it to mod the CF card reader in? And is that 100% reliable at all times? I might just do that. Screw this zip drive.

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 Post subject: Re: So Unreliable
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 10:34 pm 
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I wonder if the digital input could be messing things up... like maybe if it's damaged it might record corrupt data to the disc. Have you tried using the RCA inputs as well?

Putting in the CF reader is just as easy as swapping the zip drive... the only problem is making sure you have a compatible drive. I believe the same unit used on the MPC 2000xl's is what you want. I'm fairly certain, but I haven't messed with the CF drive for years so make sure you research it a bit to confirm. I think you have to move the little plastic thing that connects two pins on the back of the drive (probably not explaining this well). The CF reader is dope, but again... with a good drive/disc combo the Zip should also get the job done.

I hate to say it, but with all the drive and disc drama you are having it might be easier to buy a second 808! Hopefully you could swap components to get the best combo of drive/machine and then sell off the laggy one, or keep for an external effects unit, or whatever.

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 Post subject: Re: So Unreliable
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 4:21 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2014 10:20 pm
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Location: Bristol, UK
Roger is having a good go, hopefully will get somewhere:
https://youtu.be/BcUuWn4m7cA


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