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 Post subject: Using the track faders? And other misc questions
PostPosted: Sat Nov 28, 2015 11:55 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2015 11:37 pm
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What's up guys? Been reading a lot about this beast, I've had the sampler for years but recently I decided to try and actually figure it out. For the longest time, I used the 808ex as a really basic sampler. Really, just throw stuff in different banks that I didn't need sequenced. The effects are awesome too. I've never used the multi-track section, so I'm trying to decide if it is even worth using. Excuse my novice understanding, I've tried reading the manual but it's very confusing at times, and this sampler is very different from my others (Octatrack, electribes, MPC).

1.) Can you assign pads to be controlled by the track faders without recording anything? As in, say pads 1, 5, 9, 13 to the track 1 fader? Or are the track faders exclusively for recorded material? So once you track/record something, you can assign the recorded material to a fader? I guess I just want to know if I have, say two ambient loops going, can each be assigned to different track faders so I can control the volume separately?

2.) Regarding sampling, is there any other reason why I sometimes have trouble with feedback when sampling? It seems to me that as long as the PAD MIC/LINE light isn't on, the MIC/LINE fader should control the input and the MASTER fader should control the output? Why is this sometimes not the case? Both input and output cables are plugged in.

3.) What is the difference between the ways in which the effects are applied? I think that I've always used the SEND/RETURN version, but reading the manual it talked about INSERT application? I think. If I want the effects to just be applied to the pads when the EFFECTS button is pressed, what is the best option to use?

4.) What do you guys use the multi-track recorded for mainly? If I'm already using my other samplers as sequencers, is there a reason why I'd ever need to use the recorder if I just want to trigger samples with the pads? Like, you can't have loops recorded without the "Song" ending, right?



Sorry if these questions are a little vague or explained poorly. This machine is so weird and the manual does such a bad job of explaining the different ways in which you can use it. After learning the OT, this should be a breeze, but I'm still scratching my head. Thanks for any help!


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 Post subject: Re: Using the track faders? And other misc questions
PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:39 am 
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What's Good What's Good

So...yes, the 808 is very different from other samplers. And the manual is pretty messy and hard to comprehend with ease. But once you work the kinks and find that workflow with the 808, it's pretty powerful

1)
poorrichardmarx wrote:
Can you assign pads to be controlled by the track faders without recording anything?

Answer: No.

The White Faders are only for the multitrack in the 808. The only fader that controls the pads is the >> Mic/Line IN [PAD] << Fader (next to the Master Fader). But as you might know, that controls the volume of ALL the pads, not any single pad or group of pads.
If you have a loop going and you want that to be controlled by a fader, your best bet would be a little process.
1st) Go to edit the pad, and find the tempo of the pad.
2nd) go to your song settings, and set the tempo the same as your pad.
3rd) Now you can record your pad to the multitrack and it will play in-time with the grid on the multitrack. This will allow you to easily cut and paste the recorded piece over and over again giving you the same perfect loop. But now its on the multitrack and a fader instead of a pad.

^^This might have been a bit confusing. Ask if you don't understand anything, it's all good

2)
poorrichardmarx wrote:
Regarding sampling, is there any other reason why I sometimes have trouble with feedback when sampling? It seems to me that as long as the PAD MIC/LINE light isn't on, the MIC/LINE fader should control the input and the MASTER fader should control the output? Why is this sometimes not the case? Both input and output cables are plugged in.

Answer: Check your trim levels.

They are not called the trim levels but that is initially what they are.
At the top of the machine there are several small knobs.

(Mic) (Line) (Aux) (Phones)

^ Those are the knobs.^

These knobs are your actual [Input] levels.
MIC/LINE [PAD] Fader is you output level.
Master is your Speaker or headphone level.

Like a mixer:
* If your trim (input) is too high; your fader (output) will be all the way down and hard to control.
*If your trim (input) is too low; your fader (output) will be all the way up and still too hard to control
*If your trim is just right, you will be able to move the fader with ease because you won't be fighting the levels. You can move the fader and have complete control without making super small movements. you can move more freely...if that makes any sense.
If you are having feedback, my guess would be to turn down your MIC or LINE trim knobs. And make sure your source of sound is at a high enough volume.

^^Again...This might have been a bit confusing. Ask if you don't understand anything, it's all good

3)
poorrichardmarx wrote:
What is the difference between the ways in which the effects are applied? I think that I've always used the SEND/RETURN version, but reading the manual it talked about INSERT application? I think. If I want the effects to just be applied to the pads when the EFFECTS button is pressed, what is the best option to use?

Answer: It Depends

The way that I use the machine, is to use <FX Patch>.
You can [SHIFT]+[MUTE] (Master Fader) and scroll down to change your desired method.
I simply press the Sampling Button and change it there. Changes the same parameter. I use <FX Patch> in order to hear the effect and get it how I want it to sound. Then When I am ready to record or ReSample, I switch that parameter to <Insert Record>. Then Record or ReSample. And then turn the effect off and play your newly recorded piece. It has the effect recorded in it!

So that's what I do. Works pretty well and quickly, as long as you spend time learning how to manipulate the effects and the presets to get your desired effect.

4)
poorrichardmarx wrote:
What do you guys use the multi-track recorded for mainly? If I'm already using my other samplers as sequencers, is there a reason why I'd ever need to use the recorder if I just want to trigger samples with the pads? Like, you can't have loops recorded without the "Song" ending, right?

Answer: For making complete songs.

No you cannot sequence the pads. So there isn't a true sequencer.
But if you follow the method I had talked about earlier, (with the tempo match and ease of use with cut and paste) it's pretty simple to arrange your pads on the multitrack. But you only have four track (that match the four faders). And if you use up all four tracks (in stereo), than you cannot use the pads (in stereo) at the same time. And you do not get a visual view of the Sound Wave (same with the other SP-BOXes) So it can be a bit of a challenge at first.

Though you can only have four tracks at once, You do have the luxury of Bouncing (Multitrack) and ReSampling (Pads). With that, you can always conjoin tracks together into one, and have the other freed up for optional use.
But this does make for a need of a plan of some sort. Or a lot of time going back and redoing steps over to get an arrangement that you like. But for basic songs and jamming out; it works.

If you are using other Samplers and Sequencers, then yeah those will probably do a better/easier job.

_________________
...............<Gomez>................
SP-202 + SP-404SX + SP-808


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 Post subject: Re: Using the track faders? And other misc questions
PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:47 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2015 11:37 pm
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Wow! Thanks so much for the in depth reply. I knew it was worth making an account. So this pretty confirms what I assumed about the machine, that the multi-track section is entirely dedicated to making/recording a song just like a hard-disk/hardware recorder. Makes sense.

Thinking about it now, I'm pretty sure my levels were all good. Pretty sure I was just button-mashing trying to get something to work and must have changed something without realizing it - it's all good now.

That also makes sense about the effects. They almost give you more options with this thing that I feel like you need. Like in this case, while very nice and probably better in the long run, it seems a little weird that they would offer an option for the internal effects to function like an AUX-send on a mixer with external effects/hardware. I'm so used to internal digital effects on hardware and any applicable "Mix" option (dry/wet) that this is hard for me to wrap my head around.

And that's definitely a great suggestion regarding the multi-track section. I've been having trouble figuring out how I can use it since it seems quite powerful. I think I'll just maybe try and make some kind of song without any intent of using it and see if I can figure out how to use parts of process outside of actually creating a song. Otherwise, the effects and sound are good enough to just keep functioning as a stand-alone sampler!

Anyway, thanks so much for taking the time to respond!


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